Member for Cootamundra Steph Cooke, CGRC Mayor Abb McAlister and MP Ron Hoenig.
The Minister for Local Government announced on July 17, 2025, that the demerger of Cootamundra-Gundagai Regional Council into two separate councils is to proceed. On 3 October 2023, the Minister announced his support to split Cootamundra-Gundagai Regional Council provided it could develop a robust implementation plan for two separate councils.
The implementation plan developed by the Council would then be subject to a Public Inquiry and recommendation of the NSW Local Government Boundaries Commission. This was the only legislative option available to achieve a demerger of the Council.
The Minister met with Mayor Abb McAlister and the Member for Cootamundra in Gundagai to release the Boundaries Commission and Public Inquiry reports. The path is now clear for the Council to commence the detailed transition work needed to initiate the dissolution of Cootamundra-Gundagai and establish two new councils.
The Council will establish a transition management office to prepare the specifics of the demerger, including allocation of assets, liabilities, funding, shared service arrangements, staffing and governance arrangements. Completing the detailed planning and transition work is essential to ensure each Council has the best start following proclamation. This work will also inform the drafting of legal instruments by the NSW Government required to establish the two new councils.
The Office of Local Government will continue to support Cootamundra-Gundagai including monitoring the implementation of Council’s demerger proposal, and work with the Council to identify funding sources to support the transition to two new council areas.
Minister for Local Government Ron Hoenig said: “Cootamundra and Gundagai are two councils that should never have been merged. “The work by the Boundaries Commission confirms what the Council had been saying since 2016 and what I had been saying since 2012 – the former government’s ‘Fit for the Future’ policy was only a ruse to effect widespread amalgamations.
“Within several years of the merger I spoke with Mayor Abb McAlister and remember being impressed with the work the Council had done calculating the cost of the merger on the new Council. The community’s opposition was not just philosophical – it was financial and practical.
“It was for that reason in October 2023 that I decided I would do whatever I could within my power under the Act, to enable this de-merger.
“Now, the detailed transition work needs to be led by the Council, and the councillors elected in 2024 who have the mandate to do it. They are best positioned to drive this process forward and should be the ones to shape the future of their respective communities.
“Demerging a council is significantly more complex than amalgamating one. The Council’s own implementation plan highlighted there is still a lot of work that needs to be done to get to a point where two new councils can be proclaimed.
“I am confident Mayor McAlister and the elected councillors can do what is required of them to reach this outcome so we can finally close this disappointing chapter in local government history.
“Let Cootamundra-Gundagai Regional Council serve as a cautionary tale for future governments and academics who believe that merged councils provide better economies of scale and better services.
“May it stand as the folly that it was, so we can finally discard forced amalgamations for amalgamations sake into the waste bin of history.”
After nine long years, a decision that was out of the hands of the local governments of Coota and Gundagai has been allowed to be reversed. The Cootamundra Gundagai Council (CGRC) will likely be demerged under MP Ron Hoenig decision.
The MP delivered the news stating, “We will be demerging CGRC. To deliver and achieve this objective, I entrust to the democratically elected mayor and councillors that the role and responsibility of demerging councils in NSW has been a complete failure. Since 2011, I have, even from local gov before being elected to parliament, expressed my views about boundary adjustments. When the former government appointed Professor Sampson, suggested mergers from the future process was only ever a ruse to affect council amalgamations.
Repeatedly, I am on the record saying they do not work, they do not achieve the economy to scale, they do not achieve a reduction in rates and do nothing other than reduce service standards to people who are dependent on those services. The boundaries commission report, the public inquiry report and the people of Cootamundra and Gundagai know full well that they don’t work.”
“So I have a message at this time from this place to say to future NSW governments to academics and to highly paid consultants ‘merging councils for merging sake does not work,’ and that policy should be dispensed with in the dustbin of history this has been a long fight for CGRC and the people of this particular region and whilst it was a fight you should never have had to have, it became my responsibility of trying to fix it and the person who had the most impact on me was actually councillor Abb McAlister. For an hour and a half on the phone, CGRC did something other merged councils haven’t done is they went through and identified the cost and loss of service standards and the impact of the merger and de-merger. This council has always done its homework and is a shining light onto why these mergers and policies do not work and for that reason I am entrusting the council and its democratically elected councillors to effectively do the division. I would not put a time frame on it because it is difficult and they have got to get it right but once they have effectively gone through that transition exercise and finalised the process then I will cause to be prepared the proclamation that will enable the dissolution and dissolving of Gundagai council and will effect a proclamation to two new councils to both Cootamundra and Gundagai as separate councils.
“As I say, that will be a difficult process, but I entrust councillors to do so. You must entrust councillors, as they are your democratically elected leaders. They are your civic leaders. They are the ones that are entrusted with the hopes of your communities, and I trust them to do just that.”
Also present, MP Steph Cooke shared her thoughts on the De-merger. “Thank you very much, minister and welcome to Gundagai for this significant announcement and its a pleasure to be here with mayor Abb McAlister a person who we all know and love and someone who has led from the front on this issue and certainly for the last 9 years that I have had the honour of being the MP for Cootamundra.
“What can I say? This has been a journey that has spanned 2 governments, 4 premiers, 5 local government ministers, 3 appearances before the boundaries commission and 3 separate inquiries. It has been a long-running battle but it has been underpinned by a desire from these two communities, particularly Gundagai, to maintain and regain their independence, independence that they wholeheartedly deserve.
“These are council areas that should never have merged to start with and I always maintain that if i had been member at the time I would have fought tooth and nail against this merger and since being elected I’ve worked so closely with Abb and with elected representatives and with community members to bring about the announcement that we’ve had today.
“I want to take this opportunity to acknowledge the Gundagai Council in Exile group without their work and without their operations at a community level everything that has been asked of us all along the way we would not be standing here today. This is a win that belongs to the community and power of community we do have a road ahead there is no question about that. Thanks so much to the minister who has kept an open door to us for the past 2 and a half years we will work together constructively to make sure the demerger will benefit both communities.
“I’m looking forward to that day when we see two newly elected councils and the boundaries set back up that will be the day we can all sit back and celebrate. We must be sure to echo the minister’s point that this never ever happens to any community anywhere in NSW ever again.”
CGRC Mayor Abb McAlister added, “First thanks to Ron the minister especially for making this decision for our overall community and on behalf of CGRC I’d like to thank you for your decision, and to Steph who has had 8 years of this merger, thank you for your efforts, I remember when she first got the text and the first meeting the first discussion that came up was the merger and how we wanted to demerge. Steph, you’ve been a wonderful advocate for our communities and the demerger. I just really like the support of these two great politicians. It has been wonderful, I’d also like to thank the communities of the local government area they have been fully supportive of our council pushing the demerger. As Steph said to the Gundagai group Council in Exile have been wonderful.
“To the councillors who have been on council over the last 3 terms they have all been supportive of the demerger they have been a rock to me and I hope I have been to them. The journey that we’ve had has been tough but its inspiring and its one of those life experiences that you have but we finally got the result we wanted today, we start a new journey in the demerger thanks to the minis-ter.”
The media conference was then opened to questions.
Ron Hoenig
“It was the first task that hit my desk as Minister for Local Government and it wasn’t that easy since there was no legal pathway to achieve it with legal advice saying it was impossible. Senior council advice saying it was impossible so I had to find a way through and I knew it was going to be a difficult process but I was really determined to make sure it happened. I have been passionate in being opposed to forced amalgamations in councils this interference of the state in the communities, despite what governments, academics and consultants say. People never forgive them you are taking power away from there is no economy to scale. This was a council that was always able to articulate and cost the decision of a de-merger. I’ve always been in favour of the demerger, it was just hard to implement.”
Do you think other councils will try to demerge now?
“I have set up a legislative pathway for other councils to proceed down the pathway so there is a mechanism in the future for councils to proceed. The government policy is now that we will not try to forcibly merge or demerge councils, this is a decision for communities not for governments they have enough trouble trying to manage their own constitutional responsibilities they need to get their nose out of local government and communities who are capable of managing their own affairs.”
So the responsibility to move forward now is on the Council, will the financial responsibility also be on them?
“The responsibility on effecting the de-merger is in the hands of the democratically elected councillors. I was asked if I was going to defer the election last year and I said no I wasn’t prepared to do that because I needed councillors to have a mandate. I don’t want to appoint administrators to new councillors. I want to leave elected councillors in their positions out of local government and then those out of local communities that are more than capable of managing their own affairs. It’s only my responsibility to step in when they’re not. So the responibility to move forward now as a new chancellor.”
Will the financial responsibility also be on them? Will there be any support from the government?
“The responsibility on effecting the merger is in the hands of the democratically elected councillors. I was asked whether I would defer the election last year and I said no, I wasn’t prepared to do that because I needed councillors to have a mandate.
“I don’t want to appoint administrators to new councillors I want to leave elected councillors in their positions out of local government and then those out of local communities that are more than capable of managing their own affairs. It’s only my responsibility to step in when they’re not. So the responsibility to move forward now as a new chancellor.”
Will the financial responsibility also be on them? Will there be any support from the government?
“The responsibility on effecting the merger is in the hands of the democratically elected councillors. I was asked whether I would defer the election last year and I said no, I wasn’t prepared to do that because I needed councillors to have a mandate. I don’t want to appoint administrators to new councils. I want to leave the democratically elected councillors in their positions to affect the merger and to bed down the new councillors. So I have faith in elected representatives to do that. And so whatever position ultimately they are in will be matters for their own determination.”
So financially will that be on the Council as well?
“Well, councils have to run their own financial affairs. You don’t solve problems by throwing money at them. I mean, as I said to the councillors in October 2023, as you all know, you’re paying far more rates now than you ever were after the merger. So the council’s rate bases are considerably higher going out of the merger than they are going in. They have a terrific opportunity in the merger to operate for joint services and joint purchasing and sharing resources, which means that going out of the merger, they should be more efficient than they were going into the merger. So these things aren’t always financial. I know from talking to Gundagai Council in Exile, the service standards they want for Gundagai are not the same service standards for Cootamundra. And so their service standards, they believe they can operate far more economically than currently being provided. I accept that. So this is a matter for them to work through.
“As I say, democratically elected councillors actually have the hope and aspirations of the community entrusted upon them. And you need to trust them to be able to do that. And I trust them. They predict the bits of the future. They follow the convoluted process and force the amalgamation of 20 councils. None of them have worked, including Cootamundra and Gundagai. Anything the Coalition say about them having some plan to behead councils, you would put as much faith in them as you probably would put in Kim Jong-Un.”
Abb McAlister
How can you save money as the demerging process continues?
“I believe if we operate our staff structure properly, you know, similar to what we had before. I think that’s where we can probably even save money in our staff structure as to what we’ve had. But, you know, you’ve just got to, as you go along, look at the challenges and work with them. And at the end of the day, it’s to have financial sustainability. And that’s certainly where we’ll be aiming to get to.
Did the unrest in the community play a major part in this decision?
“Oh look, no, I think the decision by the Minister was done on fact. You know, the community was there pushing it for the merger all along, from day one. At the end of the day, you know, the person making the decision has got to see himself if it’s not working and he can’t judge it on community sentiment. Of course, you could have community sentiment and it’s probably working beautifully. So I think at the end of the day, it all came down to the Minister, he did what he thought was the best option and you know now and it’s up to us now to make it work and be successful. We expect to see Council start to move along with this process. Look, the Minister has said he’ll come down probably within the next two weeks to address Council as a whole, which I’d like him to do, so that they know where we’re heading and how we’ve got to head and the steps we’ve got to take.
“From there, we get on with it. You know, it could take over all the time. There’s a lot of work. It’s probably harder to be birds of birds. So, you know, it could be 12 months before we eventually get totally separate. But, you know, from day one, we’ll be working on it to get that result in the end of the day. And that’s what we all want. We’ll get there one day, and we’ll have two successful councils.
Do you intend to run again in the next election?
“Well, the next election’s likely now for 2028. But I’ll see how much fun I’m having when I get there, because I’ve had a lot of fun over the last nine or 22 years, especially the last nine years to 2018.”
“I think both those councils have had the same problems that we’ve had to know, so they’re probably fully aware. Just one more.
We just saw you choke up a little bit, and I hate to embarrass you but can you tell me how you are feeling?
“Oh, look, it means a lot. If you’re doing it for the community you love, like this community has been good to me all my life, I’ve lived here all my life, I’ve had successful businesses, and I’ve always, you know, I got on at the same time as Councillor Dave Graham, who’s still on there, you know, 22 years ago, and it’s been a great journey, and it’s something you love doing, because you only want to put something back into the community you do, and like everyone, you know, you love your community, and at times you probably get choked up”.
Ron Hoenig
Now that you have laid the groundwork will there be more demergers?
“It’s the first demerger that has happened out of the 20 forced mergers in NSW. There have been others that have asked for a de-merger. Inner West Council asked for a demerger and that was declined by the Boundaries Commission. But the Boundaries Commission has sort of set the way forward as to what to expect. But I isolated Cootamundra Gundagai when I set up that legislative program because I knew from talking to Abb McAlister all those years ago that they had done the work. And they had established clearly that it was not going to be a successful merger. My only problem was finding a legal way to achieve it. So I didn’t want to tie them up into the other process. So I wanted to try and find another way through for them.”
“There’s just one thing I wanted to add that comes from what Councillor McAlister said. And one of the things that he told me back then was that these academics and geniuses don’t think of when you merge councils is that you don’t get economies of scale because you have to create a pyramidal management structure where you might have a relatively flat structure for a small council. And that costs the current council basically, quite enormously. So, it was easy for me to decide to try and demerge this council, which should never have been merged. It was just difficult to be able to achieve it.”
So, you expect more councils to demerge in the future?
“It’s not like, that’s not an issue for me. I mean, you know what my view and the government’s view is. They are disasters, but there is a legislative mechanism, a pathway for them, and if they choose to pursue that pathway they have, One council began the process of firstly consulting their community before even requesting it to be consulted to the Boundary Commission. They worked out what the cost was. They would have to put that cost to a referendum. They decided they weren’t that courageous, so they decided not to proceed. So, each could decide themselves.”
Do we know the cost for a developing year?
“I anticipated, based upon the work from many years ago, that they would be better off. For a variety of reasons, such as the size of their increased rate base. I think their rate base is 82% higher than it was going into the merger. The fact that they can do joint services and joint purchases and that they weren’t doing before, so there’s services that should be cheaper. The Gundagai council which identified service standards that are different, also identified funding sources that are different. So, I said to the council in October 2023, it should be cheaper. You may well find that it’s cheaper.”
It’s a Labor Party policy not to be opposed to forced merger of councillors? “I mean, effectively, I’m just restoring what, if I can restore what was wrongly done. I didn’t have any opposition or difficulty with any of my colleagues. It was a ministerial discretionary matter. I needed their support, for example, to provide a mechanism for conversion, which was the amendments that went through. I do have to say that much of the local government reform that I had been implementing is being passed on a bipartisan basis with the opposition. So, as you know, the member for Goulburn is my predecessor. She comes from local government. She’s been a mayor and an administrator. So, most of the reform I’m introducing is done on a bipartisan basis. So, I don’t have any problems either with my colleagues. I don’t have problems with the opposition. It’s only a matter of me making sure I’m right.”
CGRC Councillors were asked for their thoughts on the de-merger:
Councillor Penny Nicholson, “I’m very, very happy. I keep waking up and thinking, oh yeah, that really did happen.”
So how long have you been a councillor including the previous council?
“Yeah, so this is my third term. I think it’s almost 10 years. I was elected just after the merger. So yeah, nine years, but I was on a committee prior to that, whilst we were in administration. So, I’m not sure if you count that time. So probably close on 10 years.”
And what work have you put into attempting to get the demerger to occur?
“Oh, well, I’ve been part of a team that has worked extremely hard and spent a lot of time and of course, kudos to the staff that put a lot of time and effort into it, but there was lots and lots of some-times heated discussions and deliberations, and of course, with a group of nine councillors, you’re always going to get differing opinions, but we all always had the ultimate goal in mind, and that was getting a demerger.”
And how much have the rates gone up, and how has that affected everybody in paying those rates?
“Well the rate increase to date has been 53.5% and of course it has affected people’s back pocket and we’re all ratepayers, we understand it, but of course, we always had our communities of Cootamundra and Gundagai and the villages in mind that to maintain services and live in the magnificent places that we do. Unfortunately, we like many, many other councils have unfortunately had to increase rates to continue to be sustainable.”
How difficult has it been under the CGRC to offer services to both communities?
“No, I would say that with our counterparts in Cootamundra, obviously, there’s always been representation on council from both communities and, for example, now we have three Gundagai Councillors and six Cootamundra Councillors. So I have always maintained that we need representation from both communities to have a council that is heavily weighted towards one community in that the majority is from one community. It’s just almost ridicu-lous because I rely so heavily upon the councillors in Cootamundra. They know their town better than anyone. I don’t know Cootamundra as well as what they do. And likewise, they don’t know Gundagai, so they rely upon us as well.”
Has there been animosity between the two communities throughout the merger?
“Look, I think that everybody has a passion for their community, and we get that. So, people only ever have their communities at the best, at the forefront. And of course, with passion sometimes comes some heat, and it’s under-standable. So I think that both communities have been very supportive of the Council and councillors to get the demerger over the line and I think after nine years, finally we have delivered.”
How long do you think the de-merger will take to complete?
“This is my personal opinion. It’s not coming from anybody other than what’s in my head. But what I would like to see is that the de-merger is completed within 12 months. I’d even push the envelope a little bit further and say I’d like to see it delivered or the proclamation delivered by the 30th of June 2026. But as I say, I do like to aim for the stars, but I just hope that we can deliver. But I think that the key with this, is that we must keep it simple, and if we need assistance with delivering, we’ve always maintained that we need an independent trader to come in or a specialist. To guide us through the process who can be impartial and have no bias to either community, because we want something that at the end of the day is going to benefit both communities fairly and equitably.”
What’s the council’s plan in terms of staying cost-effective throughout the demerger and keeping the costs down?
“We have an accountability to the ratepayer, so we are certainly, our motto has always been that we are not in the business of wasting money, particularly from the councillor’s perspective, that we you will hear in the council meet-ing discussions that funding and finance and budgets are an enormous part of our discussion. So I am extremely confident that we will stay true to that mantra of keeping the expenses under control because ultimately we are accountable to the ratepayer.”
Will you be working on preventing the continual cost shifting that the state government has been inflicting on local governments?
“I know that it’s always a discussion and of course a frustration because we know that our rates and our insurances and there is just a continual cost shifting stream that seems to be occurring. But I do know that the Australian Local Government Association is also pushing the barrow pretty hard with that. So it’s certainly something that everybody’s aware of and mindful of and disappointed in.”
How does the community feel about the demerger, and what role have they played in affecting the change?
“I think that the community can take an enormous bow. The communities of Cootamundra and Gundagai have been instrumental in achieving this demerger. Let’s remember that as councillors, we are the voice of the community. If the message wasn’t loud and clear from the community that they wanted a demerger, we wouldn’t have pursued it. But the message was consistently and constantly overwhelming. They wanted a demerger. They wanted it as soon as we could get it. And without the community, this would not have happened.”
How important was the Gundagai Council and Exile in seeing the demerger come to fruition?
“The council in exile were, I would say, the trailblazers for this demerger. From day one, when the merger was announced, they picked them, they rallied, they formed a group, a small group of very, very passionate Gundagai locals, born and bred, and have well-established roots in Gundagai. So they pushed the barrow and never, ever gave up. So I firmly believe and acknowledge that Gundagai Council and Exile have been, can take a big bow on this because without them, this certainly would not have come to fruition, this demerger.”
How did it make you feel? You know, what’s it mean to you personally to find out yesterday that the demerger was going ahead?
“I was quietly optimistic and I would say slightly confident but to hear the Minister say that he is going to continue or has announced the demerger of CGRC, I was absolutely elated and overjoyed and overwhelmed and I guess even a slight amount of disbelief because after nine years our dream has finally come true and of course grateful for the Minister’s support that he did find a pathway for the demerger to occur.
Former Councillor Charlie Sheahan
What work have you put into attempting to get the demerger to occur?
“Everything, like from the word go, the council were supportive of pursuing a de-merger, and that was unanimous in the first term. We went through the process before the Boundaries Commission. It was rejected in that first year. Then we put an elector base petition again, a second time. And that time we were successful. And then Minister Wendy Tuckerman agreed that we should be demerged. That was in August 2022, I think. And then we’re getting the process together. Leading up to the state election in March, which the government of the day was ousted and the Labor government came in, then it sort of stalled under the new minister and he wanted to make sure that he was comfortable with the previous government’s decision. There was some legal hold-ups, which we knew. We were informed by the previous Minister that there would be legislative changes necessary to complete the process. The current Minister became aware of that when he was looking into it, and it took him until October in 2023 to come to us and with a proposal, a path-way, which put us back before the Boundaries Commission again, basically. So we’ve been through this process three times over the nine years.
How much have rates gone up and how has that affected the community in paying those rates?
Well, like every council, we’ve had to put our rates up. We were constantly having deficits, budget deficits. The merged Council proved to be inefficient and we felt that because of the distance between the two towns. It basically meant we had to duplicate a lot of services because of the 60Ks that is between the two towns. So we pretty much kept the same outdoor staff in the yard at Gundagai and the same here. So we were sort of running two councils conjunctively in the one system. And it proved inefficient cost-wise. There was no savings. In fact, it actually cost more to run the merged council than the two separate councils. So that was clarified in this recent petition to the Minister because his requirement when he came down in October in 23 was we had to show a business plan and an implementation plan, how we would do it and in putting that together. When I look through the report by the Local Government Boundaries Commission to the Minister, is pretty word for word. That’s what is presented and it shows the cost effectiveness for both councils. It’s going to be a bit of a challenge for the communi-ties. But what the Minister wanted to see was two financially viable councils.
“At the end of the process, which meant we had to implement rate rises, even post merger, once we separate, to be financially sustainable. And it’s not much different if that request was made of any council. Most councils across regional New South Wales would have to raise their rates to be financially sustainable because everything has slipped so far behind over the years and community expectations as they are, it’s becoming far more challenging for councils financially and one of the big buzzwords in the local government sector now is financial sustainability. So, the Minister has asked us to present plans that would show two new councils financially sustainable, and the outcome of that shows that if we were separated, I think two years of 7.5% increase, and Gundagai would have three years of 25% increase.
“There is financial challenges for Gundagai, being a smaller council, because their rate base pretty much is about, I think it’s about 70-30, Cootamundra 70%. Gundagai 30% of the rate base over the Merge Council. So Gundagai would be challenged financially. They are fully aware of that. They took that and we took all that to the community and the community were prepared to accept.
How difficult has it been to offer services to each of the communities?
“Over the years of the merger, Gundagai has been able to rectify a lot of challenges they’ve had with capital and infrastructure. They’ve had a new sewage treatment plant built at a cost of around $20 million. Because their old one had it. They’ve had their whole main street completely finished. They’ve had upgrades to their water system, upgrades to their sewer and stormwater. These are capital expenditures which, put it this way, if they weren’t in a merged position, would have been challenging. But through the merged council, that’s been met. So that’s sort of given them a position where they can really tighten the belts now for a few years, because a lot of that capital expenditure has been done.
So what they have to do now is sort of rein in expenditure?
Yes, they’ll have to implement some pretty heavy rate rises initially, but they’ve got the time now with the position that their assets are in, so they can sort of ride that out a bit. And that’s shown in the plan that was put to the Minister.
Has there been animosity between the two communities throughout the merger?
“Yes. Look, there has been, and you hear stories. There’s been businesses in Gundagai who refuse to serve people from Cootamundra and vice versa and that’s pretty petty and sad. You know, Gundagai’s a very proud community and they’ve taken this really hard right from the word go and they’ve been probably more vocal about demerger than Cootamundra initially. But once the council was put together, Cootamundra residents started to realise that they were being disadvantaged by the merger as well.
How long do you envision the de-merger to take?
“The time frame that was put to the Minister states it has to be in place by end of June next year. Now it will take that. It will be a huge challenge for the existing Council now to achieve that, that implementation plan.
“The roadmap is already there because we put together in the proposal to the Minister, it even states the breakdown of assets and cash. While that will have to be adjusted or amended because those figures were taken at the end of last year when the report was put together, but it sort of puts the roadmap for them to follow. But yes, it will be challenging.
Is there any cost-effective savings you guys are going to make throughout the de-merger such as changes to your IT systems or something like that to keep the cost down?
“There is a cut. We worked that out. It’s going to be between $2.5 million to $3 million. The Minister is aware of that. And in the report, the government will be providing $3 million cost to cover those costs.
Will you ask him to help?
“Yes, we put the contingency in there that if we had to pay for it ourselves, we would.
Will you be working on preventing the continual cost shifting that the State Government has been inflicting on Local Governments across the state?
Oh, that’s always happening through Country Mayors Association, through local government New South Wales. Lobbying always, it’s continuing all the time. Great government. That’s a great way of passing on costs to local government.
Mayor Abb McAlister
How long have you been a councillor, including the previous council?
“I joined Gundagai Council in 2002. Then I joined council all the way up to the merge in 16 and then through onto the merged council for the last nine years. Nine big years.
What work have you put into attempting to get the demerger to occur?
“We’ve been working hard, you know, all the councillors in three terms of the Cootamundra Gundagai Council have all been unanimous in wanting that de-merger, so we’ve continued to lobby for it. You know, the Gundagai Council in Exile has also been continually lobbied to the Ministers at the time. There’s been three Ministers local government Ministers, Shelley Hancock, Wendy Tuckerman, Ron Hoenig, and we’ve lobbied all them over the time and continually put our faith forward how they weren’t working, and financially certainly they weren’t working, and it’s finally come to fruition.
How much of the rates going up in that time and how has that affected?
“We had a special rate rise a number of years back now in the merged councils of 53.5 percent. So you know and smaller rises each year so that’s 60 per-cent overall.
How difficult has it been trying to maintain and offer services to both communities?
“It’s just we don’t know how to maintain the services. There’s an extra cost. Just the tyranny of distance between the two towns, that’s a big cost every year. You’ve got staff driving from Gundagai to Coota and vice versa, and when they get in the car, drive there and back, you know, you lose 25% productivity a day sitting in cars. That cost of driving the distance between the two towns is probably a million dollars a year, so it’s certainly wasn’t as efficient as it was when we had before the two councils. Prior to the merger, my council, we advocated very, very hard that we could say it wasn’t going to work. But they put us together.
Has there been animosity between the two communities throughout the merger?
“There certainly has been, because it’s sort of when you merge and you’re sort of two places together, some people have animosity, but as a council and councils, we’ve tried to work together very hard to put a lot of hard work into working together to get it to work. But, you know, at the end of the day, it was never going to work. It was only just going to cost more money and whatever.
How long do you envision the de-merger to be complete?
“I think it’ll take 10 to 12 months.
What role have the Gundagai Council in Exile played in affecting the change?
“The Gundagai community, I know they’re elated and I’m sure the majority of the Cootamundra are the same. You know, from my point of view, since well before the merger, they didn’t ever want to merge. They really stuck to that rule and there have been great pushes for the last nine odd years. Once we got merged, they could try and get their council back and they’d finally done it. But I’m sure both communities, the majority of both communities are elated with the outcome.
Les Cooper
How long have you been a councillor?
“Since the last elections so just one term.
What work have you put into attempting to get the demerger to occur?
“Just following up with all the stuff that’s already been in motion. Since I joined council the community was already fighting for the demerger and it was one of my pledges when I ran for council was to ensure that it went through. Now it’s gone ahead, which is what we all wanted anyway, because no one wanted it in the first place. So finding information and just chasing up on stuff and making sure everything is in order ahead of the de-merger.
How much of the rates gone up and how has that affected the community in paying those rates?
“There has been a few complaints about the rates, but I think in general people have sort of, well, we’ve accepted them because we had a rate increase before I even went on council, but it wasn’t anything substantial but they have gone up quite a bit but I mean everybody has to accept that if even now that we are demerged that there is going to be some pain for both communities in that regard until it stabilises and we can get back to a stable footing where we can then progress ahead.
And how difficult during this time with the two councils together has it been to offer services in both communities?
“Well, it has been difficult because you get the Gundagai people want things done in their area and the Cootamundra people want things done in their area and they can accuse their councillors of spending too much on Gundagai or spending too much on Cootamundra. It’s just been a bit of a difficult fight in that regard. But overall, I think it’s been handled fairly well. There have been a few projects cleaned up like the Dog on a Tuckerbox. That’s been sitting there going for about nine years as well, so seven or eight years or something. So that was one that we got moving again. And quite a few things in Cootamundra and all the road works and get kerb and gutterings fixed up and footpaths. So it’s been good in that regard. But it doesn’t matter what you do in a situation like that, there’s always someone’s going to have a go at you and throw a rock at you.
Has there been a bit of animosity between the two communities during this time?
“Although I haven’t seen much, I’ve heard a lot of people complaining about it, whatever else, I never saw a lot myself. But, you know, every time you’re running into somebody, whether it be down the pub or the shopping centre or whatever it is we’re going, all right, how much money have we spent on bloody Gundagai this week? Or, you know, that sort of thing. And then you’d be having Gundagai, Oh, I suppose Cootamundra’s had another sports field fixed up or something, have they? or whatever. But basically you sort of take those things in your stride and it’s just people venting and a little bit of frustration. But overall, it went pretty good.
How long do you envision the demerger to take to be completed?
“Well, as I said, we’ve done a lot of the financial side of things and that sort of stuff already with all the documents that we’ve provided to the Boundaries Commission and that sort of thing. So it’s basically the IT that’s going to take us the time, just splitting all the accounts and all that sort of stuff again. So personally, I think it’ll take about 18 months to two years. I see that as quite a realistic timeline, absolutely.
Is there anything that the Council is going to be doing to save cost and be as cost effective as possible?
“We’d have to do that anyway because of the restrictions put on us whilst we’re under a merger with the amount of money that we could spend. So, you know, that’s been an ongoing thing, but I think we’ll try and keep business going as usual. We’re dealing with things as they pop up and as well as moving forward with getting the merger happening.
Are you going to be working to prevent the continual cost shifting that the State Government is inflicting on local communities?
“I’m totally against all this interference by the State Government and the bureaucrats. The biggest problem we’ve got is we don’t have any autonomy as a council anymore. We can pass resolutions and whatever else and then all of a sudden we’ve got some bureaucrat in Sydney in some department or Newcastle or wherever saying, oh no, you can’t do that. You need this permit or you need that permit, or you need to do this study or that study. And it’s just strangling everything. No wonder we’ve got no productivity in this country. We’ve got over interference from the bureaucracy. And to be quite honest, they haven’t got a clue as to what they’re doing.
“I was elated when I heard the news.”
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